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Survival Endless Cobless Setup Discuz | Plants Vs Zombies

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This is a Totally Cobless Setup Discuz on Survival Endless for Plants Vs Zombies, the hottest RTS game right now all over the world. I have received emails and comments from many countries and regions, such as US, UK, Australia, China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Malaysia, Peru, Vietnam, India, etc., asking about how and why about this Great game that Popcap Games Presents us. Some great players have posted their setup snapshots to share with us. I'd so appreciate their work and their kindness to share their valuable experiences with us. Since the previous hub Survival Endless 200 Flags and Beyond has been overloaded, I've decided to make this hub to exclusively discuz on Cobless Setups for Survival Endless. Hope you like it!

Cobless Setup Discuz on Survival Endless

Cobless Setup Discuz on Survival Endless

Survival Endless Cobless Setup Discuz

For Pros. A great collection of Survival Endless Setups with Analysis and Comments!

For Starters. Basic stuff about Plants Vs Zombies.

Talk about the best ways to deal with special zombies in Survival Endless of Plants Vs Zombies.

A List of My Favorite Casual Games and Reviews. Highly Recommended!

Cobless Setup 1 By Draco

Cobless Setup 1 By Draco

Cobless Setup 1 By Draco

 This setup can perfectly deal with the Digger Zombies and the Giga Diggers, while we have to use Ice-shrooms in assisting dealing with the Bungee Zombies as soon as they show up.

Cobless Setup 2 By Draco

Cobless Setup 2 By Draco

Cobless Setup 2 By Draco

 This setup can perfectly deal with the Bungee Zombies,while we have to replace a Pumkin on the every left line every two Flags according to what Draco said. What do you think? I think this is the more balanced one.

Yes, we have abundant Ice-shrooms since we have an imitated one to recharge. While we still have to concentrate on Giga-Gargantuars by using the Ice-shrooms frequently. We are freed from the Cob Cannon frequently clicking, so we have enough time dealing with the replacement of Pumpkins. What do you think?

I am thinking trying this setup today. 

My Cobless Test

My Test 26 July

My Test 26 July

My Test 28 July

My Test 28 July

By applying Draco's 2nd cobless setup, so far so good. Few things to add:

  • We don't have to worry about Bungee Zombies
  • Replace the damaged Pumpkins on the very left line.
  • Since we have 6 slots to plant Twin Sunflowers, we have stronger economy.
  • Probably the only threat now is the giga-gargantuar appearing at the very top & Bottom line, just use Coffee Beans to activate the Ice-shrooms. That's all.
  • I have few times to have to use the Cherry Bomb, Squash or the Jalapeno.
  • I'll keep reporting daily.
Scroll to Continue

the fuming jack hammer! By Kennedy NG

the fuming jack hammer!

the fuming jack hammer!

Actually I've figured out one very similar to this build weeks ago, while Kennedy's better than mine.However, there're certain flaws that could be fatal.


  • Making the 2nd and the 5th lane intact
  • Gloomy-shrooms have been perfectly positioned to get all the Bungee Zombies away.


  • We can't always use Jalapeno to take care of the Jacks. There should be some passive attack against Jack. Once we are in face of chaotic warfare of zombies all over the screen, it's hard for us to distinguish the Jack from the Crowd. Well, that's probably the only big flaw in this build.
  • The position where the Winter Melon stands is weak. We have to replace the Pumpkins frequently when in face of Digger Zombie Crowd. Not a big problem

What do you think of it, guys?

Cobless Setup Ultimate 08/24

Cobless Setup Ultimate Version

Cobless Setup Ultimate Version

 I'm gonna marize your comments and my opinion on this setup I figured out yesterday. So far I've come to 20th.

Wanna Write a Hub Like This?

Download Plants VS Zombies for free. While you can play the trial version for an hour. If you like it, buy it online for a lifetime access. Only by this way can you support Popcap Games to build more great games like this.

  • Super Setup for Survival Endless 800 Flags By Zorya
    See My Friend Zorya's Setup that has survived 800 flags. I feel speechless about his achievement. Also Zonra has got a good collection of other great players' amazing setups that you might never have imagined.

Interesting Hubs




Life Style


Your ideas?

Hung Man on March 16, 2014:

Skill also is very important

Kevin on January 18, 2014:

Can you show us how to do the later setup

Draco on June 12, 2013:

Oh dear!

Ronza on January 16, 2013:

Same problem here on iPad,the outer lines cannot hold the zombonis,but the inner lines stays fine,and 9 slots really piss me off

Gh on September 15, 2012:

I don't have lots of time on games.

Fh on September 15, 2012:

I don't have lots of time on games.

Jamato98 on August 20, 2012:

I play on an Ipad. How do you buy a ladder? I want to try Draco's cobless setup, but I see ladders everywhere! hehe

321yip on July 06, 2012:


Jim Raynor on June 28, 2012:

how did you defeat jack with cobless setup, i use draco setup 2 with many modifications like i replace some plants behind with spikerocks, and i use some ice-shroom. when to use ice-shroom and what is the best way to prevent jack accidents

321yip on June 26, 2012:

Cobless setups are great but without cobs I can't survive more than 40 flags without them. It really bothers me.

Angry girls on June 24, 2012:

There are 18 glooms in dracos setup. I think it is going to add up to 1050 sun. You might die if you lose too much sun. You are veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery BAD AT SURVIVAL ENDLESS DRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

asdf on June 17, 2012:

I recently saw kennedy's setup and is it possible that 4 gloom shrooms can destroy the red gargantuars, i haven't tried it yet, and actually i never played with glooms before

TheRetardedAsshole on June 17, 2012:

I am on the iPad version, and they apparently have changed the speed of the zomboni. for one the cobless setup cannot hold. the zombonis, which once could be held back using the cobless, now will crush the outer row fumes, even with fastest possible timing started by the winters, fumes, and glooms. anyway to help? P.S. I only have 9 seeds slots, and the inner row holds fine.

Golf Fanatic on March 15, 2012:

I loved Draco's setup but could not get past level 188. I suspect because I am not that agile with my mouse. I thought that more Ice Shrooms instead of Gloom Shrooms might help. Below is my solution and it works pretty well. Be wary of the Bungee Zombie because not all squares are covered by 2 Gloom Shrooms (this is required to kill the Bungee Zombie). Use the Ice Shroom at the right moment and 1 Gloom Shroom will do the job.

Mr.Superpickles on March 11, 2012:

im at 104 flags with my own setup

pvz player on March 02, 2012:

I took Draco's second Cobless set-up and changed it around a little, adding more melons to the first and last lanes, taking out one Fume-shroom. This is because of the Fume-shrooms limited firing range and placing one behind doesn't make sense to me. A second reason is because those two lanes I just mentioned do not have support from the Gloomy shrooms in the pool, so adding another melon should help. I also increased the number of cattails in the pool, since I realised that the zombies were eliminated outside of the pool and I wanted more Ballon Zombie coverage.

riskybiz_87 on January 24, 2012:

I have found that the Draco Setup 2 works best for me, but with one slight modification. At some point you have way too much sun and nothing but pumpkins, ice shrooms and coffee beans to spend it on. So what I did was I replaced the last two twin sunflowers in the back with golden magnets. Not only do I still get plenty of sun from the other 4 twin sunflowers but now I also get all of the coins/diamonds that the zombies drop when they die. This has been really helpful to me in being able to fund my Zen Garden and other upgrades. Thought?

agmelectric on December 16, 2011:

Wave 354 Cobless son... GT is AGM ELECTRIC

Person on December 11, 2011:

Ah! Sorry, misunderstood your idea. Sounds good! It still remains to be tested, unless you've done so already. It probably will do pretty well.

Person on December 11, 2011:


Good Idea! I suspect it could work.

Although, I just should give a cautionary note. The purpose of the Cattails is to pop Balloon Zombies. Remove them, and you need Blover to take care of them. This takes up a slot and some sun. Just to point out one con of your idea. Brilliant, though! Love it!

PvZ on November 13, 2011:

Well, I haven't been here in a long time. But I'll reply to some of your guys' setups.


It's a good strategy, but I personally don't think that will last long.


That's pretty much what I use now except I replace 1 cattail with a Winter-melon so I have extra attack in the pool lanes.

HDKGloom on November 04, 2011:

First a thank you for all the great info. Never thought I would get so carried away but keep being dragged into that back yard.

I am playing the iPad version. I have noted some difference compared to what apparently happens on the PC version. Specifically the "safe" Jack-In-The-Box (JIB) setup described by Draco just not hold. I quite often have JIBs blow up with this "100 pct safe" setup, so they must have changed speed or durability of the JIB on the iPad. I have tried to double up On Fumes in the inner row (column 6 and 7) but though I am not 100% sure I think I still had a blowup. Worse my outer row defense is now much weaker and I got overrun around flag 50. Using Draco's excellent number 2 setup I was able to go to 70 flags. One of the challenges with the iPad version is having only 9 slots - when you need the full emergency kit for JIBs there is very little wiggle room!

The only change I did to Draco's setup was to move the cattails to the back row. That allowed me to remove one of the Glooms in the back and have 4 Ice Melons on the back column. One gloom and the cattails killed all diggers without problem, and there was no maintenance needed on the pumpkins. The extra spot can of course be used for Ice Melon and/or ice shroom etc.

Getting the cattails in the back obviously removed some DPS in the front, but I suspect - especially with hordes of Gigas - that the negative impact is minimal. Thoughts?

Arecaceae on October 07, 2011:

This is my cobless setup, still is in test phase.

Zero on October 01, 2011:

my cobless setup

what do you guys think?

Achrdili on September 21, 2011:

I want to comment cobless setup by draco, instead of 6 twin sunflowers I left only 2 and other 4 I replaced with cob corns. also instead of 2 winter melons in first row I use coin magnets. 40 flags without problem for now I ll work on it more tomorrow.

craig xander paul creencia mamaradlo on September 14, 2011:

I think love play plants vs. zombies allow you search it

Log on http: pop cap.

craig xander paul creencia mamaradlo on September 14, 2011:

I think love play plants vs. zombies allow you search it

Log on http: pop cap.

Draco on September 02, 2011:

@PvZ Player

Could you link a screenshot? You can use the PrtSc, open up Paint, Ctrl-V, save as JPG and host on Imgur for free.

PvZplayer123 on August 19, 2011:

I just made a build that is cobless and requires no instants. Just set it up and sit back a watch. I am currently on flag 502.

I will quickly explain it:

typical gloom shroom + pumpkin in pool filling pool all the way to the end.. except there is 2 cattails..

spike rocks in row 2 and 5 near the begining and a few umbrella leaf near the end and 1 gloomshroom at the end for diggers.. rest is unfilled

rows 1 -6.. 2 spike rock in front followed by torchwood and the the rest of rows are filled with gatling peas

Draco on May 08, 2011:

You do a setup similar to the link in my Youtube description:

To just get started, you bring the usual Sunflower, Imitater, Garlic, Cattail, Lily, Fume, Gloom, Bean, Pumpkin, and Potato Mine. Then you fill up the map with Sunflowers, use Mine for the first 3-4 Zombies, then build a Cattail. Then you start making Glooms.

I would Pumpkin your stuff before you unPumpkin them.

We Game on May 06, 2011:

Thanks for the sharing of this :D

kitbala on May 05, 2011:

to draco`s harmless set up.. how to do this build?

kitbala on May 05, 2011:

to draco`s harmless set up.. how to do this build?

BOB on April 19, 2011:

i came up with that strategy but then quickly abandoned it as i failed to perfect it as gangatuars killed me :(

Sarea on April 17, 2011:

I want to know how the setups get started and how you survived the first 20 or so flags. In other words, how do you build up all those expensive gloom shrooms? Did you start with cheap offense like corn pults (the ones that throw the butter,) or what?

Rudi on April 04, 2011:

Thanks! :D

@Rudi on April 03, 2011:

The flowers are a cosmetic thing you unlock from the Tree of Wisdom. They don't help at all.

Rudi on April 03, 2011:

how can the flowers help me? I can see some of them on the pictures at the end of the grass lines. how can i use them?

pls answer. sorry, my gramar is not good :/ i am from Hungary

Draco on March 31, 2011:

Summary of "Harmless" build:

Why make it naked? I wanted to challenge myself and do something new. Removing Pumpkins adds vulnerability, but unlocks certain other strengths. For example, Dolphins will nibble on a Pumpkined Gloom in the 4th column, while it will never reach an unPumpkined one. You get Dolphin immunity from adding that space and keeping the next tile set naked. At the same time though, you are now vulnerable to ambush zombies at the end of a wave. Luckily, you can time the Freeze Shroom to activate right after the "Incoming Huge Wave" message disappears, and right before they pop out. If you do it correctly, they never surface. This is also required for Rubber Ducky zombies at the beginning of every checkpoint, because sometimes they jump in the water before the Glooms start up.

Why the ladders in the back? Those ladder Pumpkins make the back three columns immune to Imps that are thrown over. A single Gloom can take out all the Imps and can take out Diggers before they can reach.

Why so many Winter-Pults? There are 4 in the pool because Bucketheads are hearty enough to sneak into the pool sometimes, so you need that extra DPS/snare to make sure they never can. This also makes the inner row snare more stable and less likely to leak unsnared zombies. The inner row has 2 to stabilize snare too. 1 let's too many through, while 3 is overkill, so 2 is a happy medium. I like to add that Imps rarely block the Pult shots anymore because they quickly walk past the Winter-Pults due to the ladders. This streamlines the process even more.

There are some limitations to ladders, so I don't bring Jalapenos. Any consumable used on the ladders will destroy them (except Freeze/Squash). So I bring Doom Shroom to replace Jalapeno and Puff Shroom to replace Pumpkin. The consumable rotation is similar to my old cobless build where it's a Squash/Cherry for outer, and a Freeze for inner. Because the first inner row Gloom is also unPumpkined, the Gigas have to walk even farther before they can attack. This makes it even more difficult to lose an inner row Gloom, ironically.

Jack explosions are still dangerous, because they add an extra danger (if one side is compromised, Dolphins/Pool Zombies may get to nibble on things), but I have a failsafe built in. Normally, Puffs, Cherries, and Squashes will handle all the Gigas, so you save Doom Shrooms on the pool slot for emergencies. You can also stockpile Freeze Shrooms in the back if there are no Diggers. Since this build has less Glooms, replacement is cheaper. Since it doesn't require constant Pumpkining, 4 Twin Sunflowers is more than enough to sustain yourself. I haven't had trouble for 180 flags and I've sustained all kinds of Jack accidents. Enjoy.

Draco on March 31, 2011:


Hypno Shrooms would be a decent addition to fight Football Zombies, but when Gigas and Jacks are out, there is no spare card. I usually find that if I can spare a card, Puff Shrooms are far more useful in a variety of situations and have a much lower cooldown. I admit I haven't experimented with the novel idea, though. Thanks for the input.


Regarding the additional Glooms instead of Umbrella/Winter-Pult, the biggest vulnerability of the build at that point was susceptibility to Jack explosions. Yes, Glooms would be cheaper, but surviving was a much, much bigger concern than saving sun. The build is very good at bouncing back and I never lost because I ran out of sun, it was always due to dying. Also, additional, umbrella plants are superfluous, because this build is Bungee immune.

Bob on February 22, 2011:

A question on Dracos setup two. In lanes 2 and 5, colomn 4 from the house it seems better to use umbrella leaf instead of gloom-shroom. The area where imps land is already covered by 2 glooms, and that gloom appears there just so bungees die, in which case why not replace it with an umbrella? This would mean 2 less glooms so 100 less replacement cost for a jack accident.

aqualegend from Jacksonville,Florida on December 10, 2010:

Can anyone tell me how to get a set-up on here i have a successful set-up,it lasted me 239 waves before got owned by giga=gargantuars and TONS AND TONS AND TONS AND TONS of football zombies just about kicked my ass......

pvz on December 06, 2010:

I honestly think cobless are dangerous coz if badly timed jacks, add some gigas,throw in diggers, normal gargantuars =gruesome zombie death

pvz714 on November 27, 2010:

In my last comment, where I said hypno I meant squash

pvz714 on November 27, 2010:

Actually, that strategy I just gave is bad

By the way, on Draco's cobless setup 2, are the gloom-shrooms in column 1 rows 1 and 6 neccesary? One gloom in column 2 seems to do just fine, and more winter melons always helps, particularly on the rows away from the pool. Also, could one put a hypno-shroom in column 7 rows 1 and 6? It seems like the only zombies that reach it are zombonis and footballs, and with strategic placing it never hurts to have football helpers.

To kisame: Jacks explode when there is a plant on two sides of them (left and forward for example). If you put a puff-shroom on a lane by the pool, a jack reaching it would explode because it would have a puff in front and a gloom to its left

pvz714 on November 26, 2010:

column 1 is winter melon, column 2 is gloom in rows 1 and 6, umbrella in 2 and 5 and twin sun in pool, column 3 has winter melon on land and twin sun in pool, columns 456 have winter melon on land and cattail in pool, 7th row has gloom-shroom, 8th and 9th have spikerock on land and gloomshoom in pool. Umbrella leafs replace what I just described in column 5 rows 2 and 5.

(columns counted from house side)

(Needless to say, all have pumpkins)

Cons: With large stacks of zombonis, some will get through and crush the glooms if your spikerocks are down.

Pros: Gargantuars die pretty quick.

Bring along doom-shroom, cherry, squash, coffee, puff-shroom, pumpkin, imitator pumpkin, fume, gloom, lily

kisame on November 06, 2010:

can i ask something?

I just can't figure out when will jacks blow up?

i'm really crazy! It's seem they blow up randomly.

thank u very much

PvZ Maniac on November 01, 2010:

I hate to collect sun, it has to be automatic ^^

Elson Lee on October 24, 2010:

My best setup:No Cob Cannon,10 Gloom-Shrooms,4 Winter Melons,16 Gatling Peas,10 Cattails,8 Spikerocks,4 Torchwoods and 2 Twin Sunflowers.

All should be protect by pumpkins.

Always bring along Jalapeno,Cherry Bomb and Squash and always use imitater pumpkin to survive till level 200.

Elson Lee on October 24, 2010:

I survived for 200 flags without cob cannons.

I only use Gatling Peas and Winter Melons and Spikerocks and Cattails and Gloom Shroom.

The arrangement is pretty easy and I replaced them immediately once they are damaged.

Ton2xmilton on August 13, 2010:

Hey guyz, I'm inviting you to watch my video's on youtube and leave a comments for my cobless and 8 cobcorn set up.

I think my videos explains a lot of how I play my built 8 cobcorn set up to hit thousand flags and cobless set up which potentially go over 1000 flags.

I put only 2 twin sun on my 8 cobcorn set up reach me to 2100 flags and stop for a while to play cobless set up. Currently, I'm in 420 flags on my cobless formation. This quite similar to vst_70 and draco's build.

-BRAINHEART- from PHILIPPINES on August 02, 2010:

just want to say hi to all fanaticz of mind bugling PVZ.

vst_70 on July 10, 2010:

I reach 400 flags so far, after a month and I stopped playing plants and zombies (^_^) thanks draco...

Draco on July 01, 2010:


It doesn't seem to make you immune. So it seems that the only way to be immune is to leave those first 4 pool tiles blank or you get some sick cob timing and like 10 cobs.

cutieguest on June 26, 2010:

for those who are out there, can i use the innerjack solution (draco's guide, 2 fumes on the inner row) on these cobless setups?i'm tired of always losing the pool glooms!!!

Draco on June 10, 2010:


I usually just take out a pool Winter-pult or Twin Sunflower or a Fume Shroom. Something that isn't absolutely essential to the build usually works. I've seen a build where they take one of the 6 Glooms in the pool front.

mv022 on June 05, 2010:

hey draco,thanks for the setup.i have no problem as of now,but can you tell me what is the best place for a freeze-shroom slot. or is it impossible? cause i experience hardship on always finding a slot for it.

Rayson on May 31, 2010:

well... I followed the cobless setup until when I was at the 45th flag , the jack in the box blowed up the 3 gloom shroom at the 5th lane, when i rebuild another 2 he blowed them up again, I build another one and lol he blowed it up. Lol it was a funny defeat though

New User on May 17, 2010:

Hey Draco,

Thanks for your good information and the "Elegant" setup. I have been using it for quite a while now and I thought I'd let you know that I have gotten to flag 1987 with it. I have made a slight change to it though. I have linked to a photo of it (click my name). I call it "Cobbless Plus Two Cobbs". Hehe.

vst_70 on May 16, 2010:

I survived 302 flags so far and iam still hoping to reach 900flags (^_^)...hope my setup works with everyone. here's the link for my setup so far...

draco and kennedy inspired me to build this setup, I used 2 iceshrooms, coffee bean, pumpkin, puffshroom, sunshroom, flowerpot, fumeshroom, gloomshroom and lilypad. hope everyone reach 1000 flags with my me for an deeply explanation of this setup and plants i used...

Russel Crow on May 16, 2010:

i figured out this one, to be nice

???????? on May 16, 2010:

i got to flag 32 but i don't know a better set up to get farther i tried a lot of them what do you guys do to start the game

MistWolf on February 28, 2010:

that's a link to the cobless setup that i'm currently using, made it to 100+ with that, that's my second try using it what do you guys think about my lawn defense? do you guys use spikerocks to delay gigas?

btw that level has gigas (both garg and digs) and jacks hence the fumes at the inner land lanes

Kudlit from Laguna on January 20, 2010:

wARtist. I have a question for you. What's those small white flowers on the ground? Where do you get them?


ben60 on December 10, 2009:

i'm working on a setup with gatlers, fireplants, 4 glooms in the back and 2 cattails in the back. i'm now working on the front and on the bungee problem, but it looks promising

Abdullah on December 06, 2009:

Well I have a recommendation on Giga-Gargantaurs place Puff-Shroom, Sun-Shroom,Flower pots in front of them to slow them down. Also a recommendation on dancing zombies place a cheap plant on the most right row just as the dancing zombie approaches it it'll summon it really behind so no great damage can be really caused also for jack-in-the-box zombies

place a garlic in the most right row 2 and 5 that'll rescue your gloom-shrooms.

Abdullah on December 06, 2009:

Well I have a recommendation on Giga-Gargantaurs place Puff-Shroom, Sun-Shroom,Flower pots in front of them to slow them down. Also a recommendation on dancing zombies place a cheap plant on the most right row just as the dancing zombie approaches it it'll summon it really behind so no great damage can be really caused also for jack-in-the-box zombies

place a garlic in the most right row 2 and 5 that'll rescue your gloom-shrooms.

Draco on December 05, 2009:

Link the build, please.

LMB van den Berg on December 04, 2009:

I think i have a better setup, because this one doesn't deal good with giga-gargantaur. secret to take them too is to use a pool lane with 2 rows of 3 gloom shrooms, then 4 times starfruit, then twice cattail, together with spikes. no bomb needed anymore!

Maelstrom on October 10, 2009:

Your right. Puff shrooms are invaluable. I just passed flag 80 today and haven't even used Freeze. I just spammed them free shrooms and it's working.

I once saw a youtube video showing a 'Last Stand' gold farm. There's quite a few of those around, but the one I saw had a Doom Shroom placed in the pool (bottom-row). As un-orthodox as it was it actually hit all rows and didn't leave a crater.

I might experiment with it later, but since I'm doing well now I'm gonna see how far I can go.

Draco on October 09, 2009:

Well, Doom Shrooms don't really do much more than a Cherry Bomb. They're slightly more expensive, aren't large enough to hit both ground areas, and they have a chance of getting squashed. Their one advantage is that they hit farther back than Cherrys, but limiting spots to place things always sucks. Their cooldown may be longer too, I haven't used them enough to compare. It's better to bring Puffs than Dooms when Gigas come, so there's not really an opportunity to properly use them.

Maelstrom on October 08, 2009:

I'm pretty good at keeping an eye on those pumpkins. Biggest drawback is that on rounds with gigas, I'm giving up imitater pumpkin for either Puff or Imitater freeze. So pumpkins usually get prioritized more to what costs more to replace.

Yeah, my biggest problem is using consumables too often. Since I have the inner row fume setup for jacks, I often use Freeze earlier than I should. Perhaps I shouldn't worry about it too much since they always get smashed on Giga rounds. Otherwise I'd be using freeze and other consumables way too often to keep it. Damn those Jacks!

BTW what's your 2 cents on doom shrooms? I'm curious if it could be used as a last ditch effort, put behind gigas on the end of a wave or flag when there's nothing left to rotate.

Draco on October 07, 2009:

It's all about tightening the rotation.

Wasting Freeze Shrooms is the biggest penalty for that rotation and has the biggest contribution to lost Glooms. Even I can barely manage that way, so what I've recently recommended for people was to replace one of the Winter-Pults in the pool with a dedicated Freeze slot. It's much better to sacrifice a fraction of the Pumpkin maintenance than the 6th sunflower.

The next biggest problem is the looming threat of Jack accidents. Putting Fumes in the inner row seems to prevent or at the very least lower the chance of it happening. They're going to vulnerable to a lot of things and must remain unpumpkined on Zomboni levels, but their mild cost seems puny compared to 2,000 sun and a chance of death.

Don't use Cherry or Jalapeno unless you have to. Use Squash regularly. Work those Freeze timings and develop a good eye for watching Pumpkin notches.

You can always press space bar for a break.

Aside from that, it's just about keeping track of what row is doing what. What Gigas still need to be softened and what don't. Spam Puffs as much as you can, when you can use them.

Maelstrom on October 07, 2009:

Interesting. That could be something you can add to your guide. I would of suggested using 3 fumes on the outer row.

Any advice on levels with Gigas, Jacks, and Zomboni's? I got to flag 75 and not only had jack accidents, but had nowhere to put consumables. It really frustrated me, not to mention every time I tried replacing glooms they would get popped or smashed. After that I got over-whelmed and just hit the restart level button.

Draco on October 07, 2009:

Well, not to quibble over the details, if you want to achieve maximum chance of no Glooms squashed for levels without Jacks but with Gigas then you would have one side with the Fumes, and one side without.

The reasoning is this. Jalapenos can hit one more wave of zombies that can come out if the zombies have to go another 2 tiles. Which means you can hit 3-4 depending on the timing, so one side would be safer that way.

The other side would normally use Cherry Bomb and Squash, and since they don't get a benefit from length, you can maintain the Fumes up there. Since you're halving the Fume maintenance, increasing the efficacy of Jalapeno, and increasing the number of spots you can put Freeze Shrooms safely, you're effectively increasing the chance you don't lose a Gloom.

Maelstrom on October 06, 2009:

Fumes may just be for Jacks, but I use them every level. I would much rather replace an Inner Row fume than a Gloom any day. Even on Giga levels they help some. If not for the extra DPS, it also serves the same purpose as Puff Shrooms and you're always carrying around Fume anyway.

So basically the less probability I have of losing glooms, the happier I am.

What do I mean by "Banjo's"? It's part of a movie called "Deliverance".

Draco on October 06, 2009:

Correct on most counts.

The imitator is in fact used for inner row Gigas too. They can come out too quickly sometimes for just one cooldown. They have the side bonus of keeping everything snared and erasing any debt caused by unsnared zombies.

The Fumes are entirely for Jacks actually. You can remove those and still kill everything else no problem.

Also, what do you mean by "Banjo's" ?

Maelstrom on October 05, 2009:

I see what you mean by snared zombies. Some groups won't be frozen, since Winter-Pult can only attack the front group. This would mean gigas that aren't snared can pose a big problem. Puff Shrooms would help if there's no Jacks. But when you have both, you have to make sacrifices.

I suppose that's why you came up with the Inner & Outer Jack Tactic. Using the Fume shroom behind the first inner row gloom, and two behind the Winter-pult for Outer row.

So Giga or not, if there are Jacks you definitely want those Fumes there.

I get it now. Ice shroom is used mostly to slow and kill off inner row gigas, and the Imitated one should be used to buy some time for Consumable rotation for Outer row Gigas since some won't be snared immediately.

One part of your guide made me laugh hysterically...something about Gigas and 'un-mitigated rape'. LOL All that's missing is Banjo's.

Draco on October 04, 2009:

4 is definitely not enough. As long as you have that threat of Jack accidents and consumable rotation, you'll need 6 to stay comfortable.

Maelstrom on October 02, 2009:

I've been using your setup for about 50 flags now. Seems like the only levels that limit you are the ones where you need consumables like gigas or gargantuars. Sometimes I think I'm barely getting by in those.

Magnets would be invaluable if they could pull everything metallic like Gold-Magnets attract coins & diamonds.

I was also wondering if 4 twin sunflowers would be enough economy. I wanted to replace the first column sunflowers with glooms, but I'm hesistant after flag 15 when they cost 1000+. If I can do it early enough, it should save more sun with less pumpkin replacements on the left side.

Draco on September 30, 2009:

I leave the Glooms as is. You need only Pumpkin twice at most per level. It's far cheaper than replacing 2 Glooms.

Rather than Potato Mines, you could use Puff Shrooms. Shorter cooldown and cheaper. But a big issue is when you are doing levels with Gigas and Jacks, because that requires all 10 slots. There's no room for Puffs. If you're confident that no Jack accidents will occur, you don't need to bring the Lily Pad.

I'd rather not replace the Cattails for Magnets, because a lot of levels limit what cards you can bring, so it could open up the potential of screwing yourself. Also, the Magnets are ridiculously negligible, especially for the application of removing the Jacks that explode 2s after they step onto the field. The Cattails, without air, at least have the advantage of helping with inner row Gigas.

Maelstrom on September 30, 2009:

I was looking around for survival tips and this was the first google search. These are some impressive setups indeed. I also have a hard time keeping track of everything going on that a cob setup just wouldn't work for me. Keeping a track on Sun and Seeds are more important.

So I really like Draco's second setup.

One thing I'd like to comment on was Umbrella Leaf. If it can cover bungees one tile all around why isn't there a second pair above and below the Cattails? Un-necessary perhaps? It would make everything immune except for your frozen shrooms and first 6 glooms sitting in the pond.

Second, I heard you have problems with jacks. I know magnet shrooms can attract the boxes, but I suppose when there's 50+ zombies on screen it'll pull anything. You could try replacing Cattails with magnet-shrooms and just use blover during balloon rounds. That would at least protect your inner row from catastrophe. Maybe even stop a few diggers.

Third, if your worried about gigas flattening the Fumes you could always try setting up a potato mine in front. Relatively cheap and if a giga attacks it, SPUDOW!

I do have one question though, on Dolphin rounds do you replace the first two pool glooms with Tall-nuts or just leave them as is?

Draco on September 24, 2009:

I made a Survival Endless Guide for you all. I hope you enjoy.

Draco on September 21, 2009:

You can use an image hosting site that would provide you a link that you could copy and paste to dialogue box.

I use because it is very reliable and has a very high upper limit.

Terror Tomate on September 21, 2009:


I would have a fantastic tactic without cobs.

And a amazaing tactic with, too.

But I don't know how to load the pictures to the page.

Can anybody help me?

Draco on September 18, 2009:

Well, by the time the Jacks actually reach the Puff Shrooms to start nibbling, they'd be in range to explode your stuff. Since their single target damage is insignificant, Puff Shrooms are best used to slow the Gigas down only. As for dealing with outer row Jacks, the only other possible solution would be to add a 3rd Fume. I'm not even sure that'll make a difference but nothing short of a Threapeater with Torchwood will be able to help after that. Winter-pults are too unpredictable and Glooms are too limited.

Relative positioning of that Gloom/Fume ground front is what dictates how vulnerable you are to Jacks. You've seen my position, which happens to be completely immune. Move it one tile closer and it's impossible. Move it one back and you got yours. The only options left are to keep moving back, but unsnared patches of zombies will lead to a premature end.

As for immediate pool explosions, try putting Fume Shrooms where your Freeze Shrooms are. It seems that their attacking off-screen actually makes you immune to those inner row Jacks believe it or not. Football Zombies and Gigas might give you troubles, but that's something you can work around easily. Pumpkin for Football, and for Gigas it'll act as a nice buffer otherwise a Gloom might've gotten squished instead.

Dr. Zomboss on September 16, 2009:

Dear Draco, Wartist, and others,

Please refrain from using cobless setups for it makes it often way too easy for you resist my zombie hoard.

Yours truly,

Dr. Edger Zomboss

chuck on September 16, 2009:

By the way, i figure the puffshrooms will keep the jacks away enough so their explosions do not too much damige.

Also, dolphins, miners, and impss are annoying with their pumpkin chewing ways, but to fix this I just have to keep a close eye on all my pumpkins.

Most harmless zombie: catapults

Most dangerous zombie: giga-gargantuor

funnest zombie: DANCING ZOMBIE!

Chuck on September 16, 2009:

Here it is. It is mostly weak agenst jack, and gigagars, but can deal with almost anything else. The normal sunflowers are just there from my begining setup, and when they are gone, I will put puff shrooms there. The glooms to the right of the leaves are the only non esenchel thing. Any ideas?

Draco on September 11, 2009:

Could you show me a layout of your build?

Chuck on September 11, 2009:

I have created a good cobless setup, but my first run only lasted 39 flags, it is only weak agenst Jack in the boxes.

The zombies on the top and bottem wait before getting into the kill zone, but jacks explade about right when they get in the kill zone, taking out my iceshrooms, and maybe a gloom shroom or two. Plus theres the problem of instantly exploding inner jacks. I have to spots in the rows next to the pool, any sugestions on haw to hurt jacks in the top row more with those slots?

Draco on September 03, 2009:

I've actually already considered Gloomless/Cobless builds and it'd just be a bunch of Peashooters with Torchwood. Using Spikerocks for Diggers would then be ideal.

Chuck on September 03, 2009:

You know, now that we have a cobless setup... Is anyone up for the chalenge of making a cobless, and fumeless setup?

No cob cannons,

No fume shrooms,

And no gloom-shrooms.

Melons and spike rocks can be used.

wARtist (author) from China on August 27, 2009:

Thank you, Draco! I'm figuring out a new build now.

Draco on August 23, 2009:

That ultimate cobless setup needs more DPS for the outer rows. The Cattails effectiveness will drop off suddenly once Diggers/Dolphins distract them or more zombies start coming out. And to be honest, unless the Threapeaters get a Torchwood, they're completely useless. It'd actually be better for DPS to replace them with Winter-Pults for that splash than to use Threepeaters.

Darth Narf on August 20, 2009:

Draco's assessment of the fuming jack hammer is quite correct. It is a nice thought, however the Jacks just cause hell with a bit of involvement with even a single Giga, requiring the use of multiple instant effect plants for a single wave. It didn't even get past flag 19 before a Giga pulled ahead of the mob of zombies and nullified the effect of the Winter Melon - the Jack was out of range to be hit by it. The Gigas in 1 and 6 are almost wholly untouched unless a Freeze Shroom is used every time they show up and at the right spot, making it required that in a heavier combination of special zombies that you use two or more Freezes to get both the Jacks and the Gigas. Jacks also run almost wholly unhindered in 1 and 6 to explode over 2 and 5, taking out an expensive and vital line of defense.

I'm quite a fan of cobless builds, as cobs tend to require a lot of management, timing, and can later become quite expensive to replace when things do go awry. Elegant is close to one of the builds I was trying, though I'm less bothered about using replacement pumpkins than by replacing pumpkins AND a plant that comes to about 1k sun to set up.

Draco on August 15, 2009:

Good stuff, actually the first time I ran the primitive form of that build, I ended up losing to that Jack/Giga combo around 90 waves. Then I learned how to be more efficient with things, since it gets very repetitive, you learn nifty ways of getting things done. Like, a lot of the times I use the Freeze Shroom for the Gigas to stop and attack it, on top of freezing them. It works even better for Squash, and since Squash is cheaper and a lower cooldown than the Cherry/Jalapeno, I usually use the Squash first and early and it's usually up again instead of using that Cherry Bomb.

Zefith on August 15, 2009:

hey draco, i wanna tell u that my brother got a 110 with ur 2nd setup and is still going. I died at 109 cause i lost to many glooms and didn't have the funds to repair

wARtist (author) from China on August 13, 2009:

I feel the same way, Mark!

Mark on August 13, 2009:

OK. I am done with this game. Have tried both the cob and cobless setups, conclusion are:

Cobless setup is more relaxing if you have max sun, do not meet giga and jack accident, as u could let it run on its own.

Cob setup is pretty tiring as u hv to aim, collect sun etc.

Will give this game a miss unless someone can come up with innovative set up. Cheers.

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